Conversation between Keisuke & Friederike
Friederike: When constantly repeating gestures, does the intention of the gesture change?
Keisuke: How far can the performers move and still communicate through 間 (ma)?
Keisuke: I think when I speak English, my brain works very fast, faster than when I speak Japanese. Is it the same to you, or?
Friederike: Yeah. Yeah. When, um, yeah, I speak faster in English. I think in English you can abbreviate more and just be snappy and cut off, uh, words and sentences. Um, more than in German.
K: Hmm.
F:Um, and maybe also, I know it's a bit like in Japanese as well, but I think a lot of the important information in English is at the start of a sentence. So sometimes when I'm also lazy, I just don't finish the sentence.
K: Yeah, as you say, how to build a sentence is very different for me. So I think how my brain works is very different. Yeah. Because I think Japanese, we say important things at the end.
F: Yeah. Yeah. Um, I think also in English I can speak quicker and I don't have to, or just for me, I don't always think about what I say before I say it. So I might not be very concise. Um, but I can just ramble until what I want to say is out. And I think in German, I try and be a lot more, um, concise with what I want to say. So it's less words and more direct rather than telling a story and the important thing is somewhere in between.
K: Is it— is that not about the language though, or like a vocabulary, you know, or it's more like the how it’s built?
F: I think it's about the language, but I think it's also about the culture that I feel like in English you have more time. And maybe—
K: What do you mean time?
F: Like, it's not so— there's not so much of a rush. So I have more time to be able to say what I want to say. Um, and I think in German, there's then that mentality of being so practical and effective, in a short time, go!
K: Mm-hmm. I don't know, I know more vocabulary in Japanese, of course. But sometimes it's easier to tell in English because it's direct for me. And sometimes in Japanese it's too— it's like—
F: Too long?
K: Too long or too abstract. Or we use a lot of like— weird sound. How does it call it? I don't know, like
F: Onomatopoeia?
K:Yeah.
F:Yeah. I love it though. I love the onomatopoeia because I think that's easier than words.
K: Do you also use a lot in German?
F: No, I don't think so. I don't, no. Um, no, I think in German we have very little, but then they have a lot of different meanings. So they're very versatile. Um, maybe like, eh, you know, it can be put in a lot of different contexts. Um, but I like onomatopoeia and the sounds because I think They can help emphasise the words and the gestures and what you're saying. It's like another layer.
K: Yeah. Sometimes it helps a lot when I work because it's easier to share my image or idea.
F: Yeah. Yeah. No, I agree. It's, yeah, it is direct because I think sometimes when the image isn't clear for me, or if it's too difficult to explain, um, make, yeah.
K: Yeah.
F: Yeah. I’ll make a phuuuuuuuu or a tschk tschk tschk tschk tschk tschk.
K: Yeah, onomatopoeia and also gestures, I think I use a lot, like, I don't know, fuwa fuwa or like, yeah.
F: Yeah, I think, um, with gestures or like, um, when we repeat stuff or we have to build on stuff, I like onomatopoeia because I can also do gestures and the amount of times I do a gesture can show maybe how long I want someone to work with something instead of being like, turn 3 times, you know? But I'll be like, and on and on and on and on and on. Yeah.
K: Interesting. I never thought about that. What else?
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F: Yeah, I think I also, I think I express like how I hold myself or my posture a little bit differently as well.
K: Hmhm….How?
F: I think when I am speak English, I'm a bit more slouchy, um, because I know I have the time to think and just to speak, that I'm maybe a bit more relaxed than, um, when I speak German, I know what I want to say and express it, and so I'm delivering something more, maybe. Mm-hmm. Yeah.
K: Hmm.
F: Is it different for you?
K: No. I don't know, I feel like when I speak Japanese, less facial expression or less… I don't know. I think the gestures I use for both a lot. Hand gestures, but the posture, yeah.
F: Yeah, I think gestures is important in every language. Well, I use it a lot. In all of them.
K: And also how I listen the words, I think it's different. Because when I hear Japanese, I have to think about how this sentence connects in the context of the topic because sometimes it's too abstract and there's no subject. So my brain— and English is clear, like who speaks what and in which context.
F: Mm-hmm.
K: So I think the brain works differently for me. That's why sometimes I get confused. For example, like, it takes time to switch.
F: Yeah, yeah. I think it takes time to switch, but sometimes I also— I don't think between German and English I can always tell what language it is.
K: What do you mean?
F: Sometimes, and it happens in situations where both languages could be used, so maybe in like music or in a work situation where performers who can speak English and German, or there's text with English and German, because I understand both fluently. I'm, I'm not like, that's German, that's English, and I just hear it as like one. And then I'm like confused about what language I have to communicate in.
In every language I speak, I use a lot of hand gestures, and I think it's important to each one? I don't know. I don't— I think it's very important, or I use it a lot for me in German for like extra information. And I think in English I use hand gestures sometimes instead of saying the information to save time. So I think for me it's very— Save time means... Yeah, yeah. And so I feel like out of the different cultures I use the gesture, but maybe because of different reasons. Mm-hmm. Um, and I know in languages that I don't— I'm not so fluent in, and like, I'm trying to think of the vocabulary that's maybe in the back of my head, I'll do hand gestures to keep the interaction, like, going or interesting.
K: Mm-hmm.
F: So I don't just stop and give nothing. And so I'm then— my brain might be, like, thinking and tick, tick, tick, and my hands are still with you and giving you stuff and maybe Showing you that I'm looking and finding for what I want to say.
K: Yeah, makes sense. For me, I think I'm using a lot of hand gestures, like my own hand gestures, to help to support how I speak, like When I move my hands, I don't know, somehow I feel like my brain works better than without, doing nothing. I don't know, maybe makes me relaxed a bit. Yeah. I noticed I use a lot of hand gestures when I speak. But not specific hand gestures. It's more like— I think I use a lot of this when I explain something. Hmm. You know, but I never thought about the hand gestures as a, like— Adding in between the sentences to have some, like, time. Yeah, maybe I would do that. I also do that.
F: Yeah, I think I love talking and communicating with people, but I know that, um, it— oh, some people find it awkward when there's like a time and space of nothing and have it, um, like in English, it's the awkward silence. Yeah. Um, and I'm fine with that.
K: I kind of like it though.
F: Um….. and so I think I then use the hand gestures because It's then not— it is a pause when I need to think or if I just need some time from speaking, but the hand gestures carry on giving something to who I'm speaking to. So if they feel like awkward or like, hmm?
K: Mm-hmm.
F: There's still something in between us.
K: Mm-hmm.
F: Yeah. And also, I think from my hearing, but I think also from, like, understanding and being brought up with German, I'm very direct when I speak to someone and how I face them.
K: Mm-hmm.
F: Like, I want to see their face clearly from the front, and I make a lot of eye contact. And I think my eyes speak a lot. They might, like, look for the other person's eyes and, like, my way of showing, like, I'm interested. Um, and yeah, so I think it can be a bit glary.
K: Hmm. Yeah, I think now I'm very comfortable with doing eye contact, but as we talked the other day, I think that's very different how we communicate in Japan, especially because I don't know. Every time when I go back to Japan and then I go shopping, no one do the eye contact. And then sometimes I feel very sad because I think looking someone's eyes is very— I think that's also like a different layer to understand. Um, yeah, yeah.
Do you think that's a very German thing? Because also when I was in the States, I didn't think about eye contact a lot.
F: I think it's very German to, maybe hold it. I feel like in the UK you find eye contact, but it can then go.
K: The quick eye contact?
F: Yeah.
K: Yeah. I like it to hold longer.
F: Yeah. I do. And I think also, maybe when I'm speaking and I'm thinking, I might, like, break the eye contact to look around. But when I'm listening to someone, I really hold the eye contact.
K: Yeah. When I try to teach how…. how good it is in Japan, but a lot of people think I'm like kind of weird, all that looking, staring in the eyes for a longer time.
Yeah. I think that's one of the big differences between, uh, culture here and also in Japan. Also like touching.I don't know, it's It's not gesture, but like how to communicate. We don't touch, no hugging, no— yeah.
F: Yeah, that's, um, yeah, I think Germany, it is touchy, but not always. But I think it's very a lot with the stare and the look. And I think in Britain it's more touchy, but a bit less intense in the face. But I found it— I'm a big hugger.
K: Big hugger.
F: I'm a big hugger. And so I think also being a dancer and working so much with other bodies, I'm very— like, I feel safe and used to it.
K: Mm-hmm.
F: And I forget that maybe people don't feel so secure with it. But so I had to get used to when I was in Japan to not just hug people. But at the end, I then found it so nice to kind of have a bit of that space because it felt safer in a way.
K: Like a personal space also?!
F: Yeah. And when you're thinking of like, oh, maybe they don't feel well, or maybe they just— when I was more thinking about them, I was then like, oh, this is like maybe a nod, or not a proper bow, but something. It's like I'm saying hello and greeting, but like I'm just being aware of you.
K: I think having a space in between is, uh, Very Japanese culture, I would say. I don't know. Also like a physical space. Also the language, like we have a lot of blank space in the sentences. So like communication, I think that's why I don't feel that like— how did you say— awkward silence? I've never felt that. No, I don't know……But I'm fine with, like, silence.
F: Yeah.
K: Yeah. And that happens a lot.
F: Yeah.
K: Yeah. When I'm speaking.